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  • Cessna C337 SID - Page 3 - Skymaster Forum
    are hopeful that our findings will lead to SIDs which are far less burdensome than the draft versions but this remains to be seen and will depend on future meetings with Cessna The Committee is also reviewing the matter of the 20 year from manufacture compliance period which for Skymasters will mean immediate compliance for certain operators who are required to comply or for those owners wishing to voluntarily comply with the SIDs This same 20 year time trigger was used in the SIDs issued previously by Cessna for the 400 series aircraft despite opposition by 400 series owners and operators and the repair corporation they formed and funded to address compliance However in our case the Committee believes that there are grounds for recommending to Cessna that this provision be modified for Skymasters Work on this matter continues At this time we are in the process of finalizing our analysis of the SIDs and formulating a report for Cessna Cessna engineering staff are scheduled to visit a Skymaster service shop that has aircraft in various states of disassembly for inspection This will allow Cessna to consider the proposed SIDs and possible alternate inspection approaches to address the areas of concern with the benefit of actual disassembled aircraft to examine SOAPA will have a representative at this meeting as well We expect to fold any developments that come out of that meeting into our report and are targeting to have our report provided to Cessna by mid October We will keep you informed of any further developments or changes to the above as soon as we are able Should you have any input that you would like to provide to the SOAPA Committee members working on this matter please provide this directly to SOAPA President Herb Harney hharney sbcglobal net or reply openly to this thread Last edited by hharney 10 06 09 at 04 42 PM larry bowdish View Public Profile Find all posts by larry bowdish 36 10 03 09 04 26 PM skymstr02 Ace of the Atmosphere Join Date Apr 2002 Location Madison MS Posts 305 Thanks for the update Larry skymstr02 View Public Profile Visit skymstr02 s homepage Find all posts by skymstr02 37 10 03 09 07 20 PM Alfonso Registered User Join Date Sep 2005 Location Washington DC Posts 26 Cessna Sid Update Thank you very much for the update Please remain to the Committee that the Cessna 336s in some areas are better that the C 337s and that there are very few remaining C 336s Thank you for your good work and best regards Alfonso Diazdelcastillo N695AD C 336 Alfonso View Public Profile Find all posts by Alfonso 38 10 03 09 10 06 PM Rafful Registered User Join Date Apr 2007 Location none Posts 12 Our Skynaster user owner voice I think it s enough for me to say I am grateful supported and trusted on these people owners and or experts in this type of aircraft which are operating in

    Original URL path: http://www.337skymaster.org/messages/showthread.php?t=2513&page=3 (2016-04-26)
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  • Cessna C337 SID - Page 4 - Skymaster Forum
    This particular inspection is targeted for every 24 months The corrosion prevention program is voluntary but if implemented it will decrease or eliminate the need to repeat SID inspections based on calendar The SID inspection would be based only on hours operated if you chose to follow the Corrosion Prevention and Control Program CPCP After spending most of the first day on some background information and the CPCP program there was some time at the end of the day to start reviewing the 2nd draft of the Supplemental Inspection Documents SID Most of the original SID s were revised with the correct part numbers and application to the correct model Skymaster The second day started with continuing to review the 2nd draft of the SID documents Just as the 1st group of draft SID s the wing attach and strut attach point inspections were included in the 2nd group of drafts These two inspections are the most costly to perform and caused several hours of discussion amongst the group Cessna engineering based all Skymaster SID s on Service Difficulty Reports SDR that had been submitted to the FAA by maintenance personnel over the last 35 years There are no SDR s pertaining to the attach points of the wing or strut on 336 337 aircraft There have been some cracks in the beam of the struts on some high wing strutted Cessna but none at the attach points There was no resolution achieved concerning the future of these two inspections but Cessna Customer Service is looking into the concerns that were presented by SOAPA and other operators of Skymasters There were 24 SID s proposed in the 2nd group of drafts Of those 24 5 may be eliminated One was revised and eliminated by combining it to a different SID document One is for 336 aircraft only front engine tubular mount One will reference the wing AD that already exists This leaves around 18 SID s so the group made some progress Cessna then presented the implementation plan for the SID and CPCP programs for the 336 337 series of aircraft they will be rolled into a new Service Manual and in a new format called ATA There was much discussion and question about the implications to operators of this approach as to whether it would make the inspections mandatory at annual or 100 hour inspection time even possibly for US Part 91 operators The answers were unclear and seem to depend on interpretation of the FARs There is concern that this lack of clarity may mean that many IA s err on the side of caution and insist on these inspections for inspection sign off even though they may not legally be required to do so What happens from this point is in the hands of Cessna The Cessna Customer Service side seems sympathetic to our concerns to soften the burden or at least take another good look at the program and how it will affect the fleet Cessna

    Original URL path: http://www.337skymaster.org/messages/showthread.php?t=2513&page=4 (2016-04-26)
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  • Cessna C337 SID - Page 5 - Skymaster Forum
    Either the factory methed or an approved alternate but still compliance Unfortunitally I don t know anyone who s got the cash to do the engineering to come up with an alternate means of compliance It s like saying I m not gonna do an annual caus my IA doesn t want to There are several ways to do an annual but they must be approved ways and they will all referance the aircraft service manual or at the berry least specific literature for minimum requirements in the FAR s But agin the FAR s are silent on this detailed of a procedure so the ASM will be controlling Agin Cessna must have some kind of motivation for gowing through all this for an out of production type For all our sakes I hope I m wrong Or maby Cessna will note that the procedures are optional in the book and we can for get about it till they decide to change there verbage Travis travis View Public Profile Find all posts by travis 67 12 14 09 08 05 PM hharney Rough Surface Join Date Jul 2002 Location Michigan 08C Posts 1 640 Travis I remember meeting you at OSH You are from the Ft Worth area and I asked you about landing at Mecham At the meeting in Wichita we also discussed the rule that says paraphrase for inspection follow the Section in the Service Manual that was delivered with the airplane This may be another way to qualify our original inspection list rather than adopting the new one Herb R Harney 1968 337C I m in the front of the aircraft to prevent it from committing suicide Last edited by hharney 12 14 09 at 08 07 PM hharney View Public Profile Visit hharney s homepage Find all posts by hharney 68 12 14 09 08 58 PM travis Registered User Join Date Sep 2003 Location KFWS Posts 78 That s me The plane lives at Spinks though KFWS south of down town I really hope that all of this blows over and the aircraft will be proven safe and reliable with out any extrainious inspections I just had my tail appart last year and while it s a rather small job in a relative sence but it is a real pain in the ass Like I said I work for an aircraft manufacturing company and I have seen hundreds of millions of dollars worth of inspections and alterations delt out with little concern for cost to the operator I love the Skymaster but I can t spend 20k on anything right now I hope ot doesn t come down to that cause I would have to sell at a loss if that were the case travis travis View Public Profile Find all posts by travis 69 12 18 09 06 18 PM Shalimar Registered User Join Date Nov 2009 Location Phoenix AZ Posts 8 Don t wait on a 337 purchase I recommend that ipassgas take and underline Roger s final point Life is what happens when you let other people decide your fate This is an on going issue with all aging aircraft SOAPA is doing a superb job representing us all and the issue should sort itself out That said since the concern seems to be for the higher time airframes i would suggest finding one with 3000 hours or less this becomes academic if they base it on calendar years which seems even more senseless A bigger issue facing all of us is the possible future demise of 100LL but we can t let that stop us either Recommendation Find a lower time 337 that has been well taken care of has good logs and a knowledgeable owner Find an A P IA that knows and loves Skymasters and pay him her for a complete pre buy suggest not the same shop that performed the last annual Since you are experienced with the type you probably already know many of the foibles and should have an idea what to look for if not this website has many knowledgeble and experienced pilots mechanics and owners That can offer some suggestions But don t wait on this issue Good Luck Shalimar View Public Profile Find all posts by Shalimar 70 01 12 10 02 56 AM Mark Campbell Registered User Join Date Aug 2003 Location Seattle Posts 14 They Know Twinned Tailed brothers I have looked at this from a few different angles One if they want to get rid of us or better yet said cull the active fleet number down what would be the way to do it while appearing to used the context Safety it s a buzz word fells Ok if there is a possible problem define it which they are formulating We comply and live to fly another day Second though get rid of the problem find the point that no one would bear Evoke an inspection program that would be so expensive along with intrusive very few could comply with I believe to quote a phase By their Actions you will know them My aircraft is now still in pieces and I will not start reassembled until these gentlemen decide which tool they will use the pencil lead or the Eraser At the conclusion of this process We Will Know them Mark Campbell View Public Profile Find all posts by Mark Campbell 71 01 12 10 03 40 PM hharney Rough Surface Join Date Jul 2002 Location Michigan 08C Posts 1 640 Mark Put your plane together and enjoy it We don t have to comply even if this does go through It s the foreign guys who have the issue to comply with Here in the USA it s a non event for now Only if the FAA rolls them to an AD will we be screwed I really don t see that happening given the history of the airplane It s solid and over built the military

    Original URL path: http://www.337skymaster.org/messages/showthread.php?t=2513&page=5 (2016-04-26)
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  • Cessna C337 SID - Page 11 - Skymaster Forum
    homepage Find all posts by hharney 156 01 20 14 06 28 PM hharney Rough Surface Join Date Jul 2002 Location Michigan 08C Posts 1 640 From Don Nieser Herb and Dave my recommendation is DO NOT REMOVE THE RIVETS IN THE BOTTOM FRONT SPAR TO DO THE SID INSPECTION The problem is Cessna made a mistake when they wrote the SID The way the SID is written it tells to do a wing spar Eddy Current inspection of the holes in the bottom front spar at the area just outboard of the strut attachment and they made it applicable to all 337 and 0 2 Skymaster serial numbers This SID inspection is exactly the same as the original Wing Spar AD put out by the FAA AD 78 09 05 The mistake by Cessna is that they should not have included all serial numbers in the SID If one reads the 337 Wing Spar AD 78 09 05 one will find out that it correctly does not include all serial numbers because the 337 aircraft with serial numbers higher than 1852 wings were beefed up made stronger and did not have the screw bolt holes in the bottom front spar The late model wings had rivets in the location that The AD 78 09 05 and the SID say to Eddy Current the screw bolt holes It is absolutely ridiculous for people at Cessna to tell him to drill out the rivets This is not the first time this issue has come up I tried to get Cessna to make a correction to the SID but they don t listen to me My recommendation is to make a note in the log book stating that the AD 78 09 05 has been accomplished on the wings and the SID inspections have been accomplished up to the but not including the Eddy Current inspection of the screw bolt holes in the bottom front spar because Cessna made an error when they wrote the SID Herb what is Dave s aircraft serial number What is his last name I think Cessna should put out a letter to all 337 owners of aircraft with serial numbers greater than 1852 stating that the SID is not correct You can post this on the SOPA web site message board or I will when I get time Don Nieser Commodore Aerospace Corp 405 503 4686 Herb R Harney 1968 337C I m in the front of the aircraft to prevent it from committing suicide hharney View Public Profile Visit hharney s homepage Find all posts by hharney 157 01 22 14 06 01 PM SkyMac Registered User Join Date Sep 2010 Location Australia Posts 100 Hi Guys Don Herb many thanks for the quick responses to my dilemma Based on your feedback Don we have now completed all SID s with the exception of the front and rear spar screw holes Given mine are rivets and the current SID does not detail any information regarding

    Original URL path: http://www.337skymaster.org/messages/showthread.php?t=2513&page=11 (2016-04-26)
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  • Skymaster Forum - View Profile: hharney
    Contact Info Join Date 07 27 02 Posts Total Posts 1 640 0 33 posts per day Find all posts by hharney Find all threads started by hharney Home Page http www youtube com user roughsurface Additional Information Group Memberships Date of Birth December 13 Aircraft type eg 69 T337D or none 1968 C337C PA 30 Location Michigan 08C Biography Idaho Native loving the Mid West Occupation Helping People Smile

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  • Who Posted? - Skymaster Forum
    9 edasmus 5 K337A 5 Gord Tessier 4 Mark Campbell 4 travis 3 sns3guppy 3 Paul462 3 ipasgas1 2 Jim Rainer 2 SkyMac 2 tkirklindale 2 John Hoffman 2 Guy Paris 1 iswap 1 Francisco 1 LeeChris 1 rschimizze 1

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  • General Skymaster Info & Tips For Buyers - Skymaster Forum
    from the rear engine It may have even been simply oil coming from the breather I had a tendency to keep the engine topped up in oil but it wreaked havoc on the rear deicing boot The rubber on those boots muct have been designed in the 1930s becasue it swelled up like latex when it got even a hint of oil on it The boot is expensive so you don t want to be replacing it every year I assume there is an answer but I never found it I don t know what people were doing to the engines on P337s to cause them to need overhauls at 300 or 400 hours but I saw many P337s that required overhauls at those intervals At the time I owned the P337 I was a B 52 pilot and used to following strick proceedures so maybe I was more conscientous regarding turbo cooldown rapid power changes leaning and cowl flaps than your typical owner but whatever the case the engines were trouble free other then the rear engine oil leak Cabin The cabin in the P337 is about the same as a P210 Certainly not what anyone would call cabin class but a decent 4 person plane with a reasonable amount of baggage The one issue with the P337 vs a plane like a 210 or other large single is that they is no room behind the rear seats if you have all 5 in Since the engine is behind the seats the only baggage space is in the main cabin I remember comming back from Mexico with my wife and 2 friends with so much stuff in the cabin that the rear seat passengers had to sit on top of it The useful load and CG range was great 1500 lbs so even with full fuel 750 lbs you could legally fly with virtually anything you could fit in the cabin I could not come up with a realistic scenario that would have the plane out of CG range Handling The USAF used these planes a FACs Forward Air Control and those guys beat the heck out of them The planes were often overloaded so badly that they wouldn t even maintain altitude on one engine In addition the pilots had come out of pilot training where they flew planes with 6 66 and 7 2 g limits T 37 T 38 so they were used to yankin and bankin I have heard that the issues with the wing spar on the 337 came from experience with spar failures on USAF 0 2s I don t know if this is true but it would make some sense In any case since I had spoken to guys who had done some acro in their O 2s and there was a guy actually doing a routine at airshows in a skymaster at the time I decided to try it in my P337 Aileron rolls were easy with just a few degrees nose up prior to the start and ending a few degrees nose low I did not have a G meter so I was unwilling to try a loops but I am sure it would be possible to do one without an over g but I would very much not recommend it to anyone not extremely familiar with acro in a wide range of aircraft captbilly View Public Profile Find all posts by captbilly 3 12 17 09 09 48 PM larry bowdish Dive Bomber Join Date Apr 2002 Location Kalamazoo MI Posts 1 512 Great Information Thank you Great information for the P models larry bowdish View Public Profile Find all posts by larry bowdish 4 12 18 09 11 17 AM Shalimar Registered User Join Date Nov 2009 Location Phoenix AZ Posts 8 P337 I am the proud owner of P3370196 my second 337 the first was a 65 s n0028 I am also an A P IA and do as much of my own work as I can The earlier comments on performance are right on my numbers are close to what was reported You do need to treat the engines properly including cool down and proper application of power The airplane is very difficult to work on It has numerous systems all crammed into a tiny space so systems must be removed to get at other components needing maintenance Pressurization brings a whole new level of care requirement when penetrating the pressure bulkhead Having said that the system itself is pretty much maintenance free Vibration remains a concern on all Skymasters Check the rear spinner bulkhead and rear cowling and baffles for cracking For some obscure reason Cessna riveted the center floor board access panel on the later models replacing the screwed on system on the earlier aircraft This add a whole new challenge to routing wires or even inspecting the landing gear hydraulics I replaced the rivets with nut plates and screws on an FAA field approval A key point which has been made earlier is that all Skymasters are cheap to buy but expensive and time consuming to maintain A low first cost may mean that the aircraft was not well taken care of Better to pay a little more and get one that has been taken care of Still love the airplane and would or will do it again Shalimar View Public Profile Find all posts by Shalimar 5 12 19 09 11 09 AM hharney Rough Surface Join Date Jul 2002 Location Michigan 08C Posts 1 640 Vibration Since installing the MT composite props 6 years ago can t believe I have had them that long I have notice a significant decrease in vibration related issues Rear muffler is a good example I normally figured at least every other annual to repair cracks I have had none since the MT s The composite material primarily beechwood absorbs the vibrations caused from those lovely Continental engines With the aluminum blades this vibration is just

    Original URL path: http://www.337skymaster.org/messages/showthread.php?t=2190 (2016-04-26)
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  • General Skymaster Info & Tips For Buyers - Page 2 - Skymaster Forum
    12 12 52 AM rotorgoat Registered User Join Date Jan 2012 Location Blazin Desert AZ Posts 7 Thanks Herb I ve noticed the dates on some of the posts were somewhat dated I thought I d mention the Gen Info Tips for Buyers links as I ve seen many in the forum including myself referred to the Post only to find a dead end rotorgoat View Public Profile Find all posts by rotorgoat 20 07 14 12 06 13 AM hew Registered User Join Date Aug 2011 Location Australia Posts 29 Buying a 337 Here s a suggestion Get hold of the SID s most of these are visual inspections Go through these with an A P mechanic Use anything you find to negotiate the price or abandon the purchase The hard part of the SID s if you are not going to stay in the Private category is the three small screw holes in the spar the jacking point and two next to it To get them out you have to remove the fuel tanks as the nuts are not captured Thanks for the foresight Mr Cessna hew View Public Profile Visit hew s homepage Find all posts by hew 21 03 01 15 06 25 PM jcskydriver Registered User Join Date Dec 2014 Location none Posts 4 P337 pre buy inspector Does anyone know pre buy inspector that knows skymasters some where on the west coast I like to know someone that knows the plane inspect it on a pre buy you can post it or email me thanks John jcgearup1 gmail com jcskydriver View Public Profile Find all posts by jcskydriver 22 03 01 15 07 33 PM JeffAxel Registered User Join Date Mar 2007 Location Portland Oregon Posts 113 Dirk Wittig at Northwest Aircraft Maintenance at KHIO took care of my P337 for 3 years Took the CPA 337 Systems and Maintenance course too If the plane you are looking at is in the Pacific Northwest his number is 503 648 3670 Good thorough guy JeffAxel View Public Profile Find all posts by JeffAxel 23 03 01 15 09 03 PM hharney Rough Surface Join Date Jul 2002 Location Michigan 08C Posts 1 640 West Coast is a large area is there a specific location that you could provide It may help to achieve a better response Herb R Harney 1968 337C I m in the front of the aircraft to prevent it from committing suicide hharney View Public Profile Visit hharney s homepage Find all posts by hharney 24 03 01 15 10 03 PM jcskydriver Registered User Join Date Dec 2014 Location none Posts 4 P337 inspection Quote Originally Posted by JeffAxel Dirk Wittig at Northwest Aircraft Maintenance at KHIO took care of my P337 for 3 years Took the CPA 337 Systems and Maintenance course too If the plane you are looking at is in the Pacific Northwest his number is 503 648 3670 Good thorough guy Thanks for the info John jcskydriver

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