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  • Statistics and R « Climate Audit
    information on R can be difficult though Baron s R search tool is a great help so DSN has put together a search widget that only queries R sites Post a Comment Click here to cancel reply Required fields are marked Name Email Website Comment Notify me of new comments via email Notify me of new posts via email Tip Jar The Tip Jar is working again via a temporary location Pages About Blog Rules and Road Map CA Assistant CA blog setup Contact Steve Mc Econometric References FAQ 2005 Gridded Data High Resolution Ocean Sediments Hockey Stick Studies Proxy Data Station Data Statistics and R Subscribe to CA Tip Jar Categories Categories Select Category AIT Archiving Nature Science climategate cg2 Data Disclosure and Diligence Peer Review FOIA General Holocene Optimum Hurricane Inquiries Muir Russell IPCC ar5 MBH98 Replication Source Code Spot the Hockey Stick Modeling Hansen Santer UK Met Office Multiproxy Studies Briffa Crowley D Arrigo 2006 Esper et al 2002 Hansen Hegerl 2006 Jones Mann 2003 Jones et al 1998 Juckes et al 2006 Kaufman 2009 Loehle 2007 Loehle 2008 Mann et al 2007 Mann et al 2008 Mann et al 2009 Marcott 2013 Moberg 2005 pages2k Trouet 2009 Wahl and Ammann News and Commentary MM Proxies Almagre Antarctica bristlecones Divergence Geological Ice core Jacoby Mann PC1 Medieval Noamer Treeline Ocean sediment Post 1980 Proxies Solar Speleothem Thompson Yamal and Urals Reports Barton Committee NAS Panel Satellite and gridcell Scripts Sea Ice Sea Level Rise Statistics Multivariate RegEM Spurious Steig at al 2009 Surface Record CRU GISTEMP GISTEMP Replication Jones et al 1990 SST Steig at al 2009 UHI TGGWS Uncategorized Unthreaded Articles CCSP Workshop Nov05 McIntyre McKitrick 2003 MM05 GRL MM05 EE NAS Panel Reply to Huybers Reply to von Storch Blogroll Accuweather Blogs Andrew Revkin Anthony Watts Bishop Hill Bob Tisdale Dan Hughes David Stockwell Icecap Idsos James Annan Jeff Id Josh Halpern Judith Curry Keith Kloor Klimazweibel Lubos Motl Lucia s Blackboard Matt Briggs NASA GISS Nature Blogs RealClimate Roger Pielke Jr Roger Pielke Sr Roman M Science of Doom Tamino Warwick Hughes Watts Up With That William Connolley WordPress com World Climate Report Favorite posts Bring the Proxies up to date Due Diligence FAQ 2005 McKitrick What is the Hockey Stick debate about Overview Responses to MBH Some thoughts on Disclosure Wegman and North Reports for Newbies Links Acronyms Latex Symbols MBH 98 Steve s Public Data Archive WDCP Wegman Reply to Stupak Wegman Report Weblogs and resources Ross McKitrick Surface Stations Archives Archives Select Month February 2016 January 2016 December 2015 September 2015 August 2015 July 2015 June 2015 April 2015 March 2015 February 2015 January 2015 December 2014 November 2014 October 2014 September 2014 August 2014 July 2014 June 2014 May 2014 April 2014 March 2014 February 2014 January 2014 December 2013 November 2013 October 2013 September 2013 August 2013 July 2013 June 2013 May 2013 April 2013 March 2013 January 2013 December 2012 November 2012 October 2012 September 2012 August 2012

    Original URL path: http://climateaudit.org/statistics-and-r/?replytocom=37475 (2016-02-08)
    Open archived version from archive


  • Statistics and R « Climate Audit
    can be difficult though Baron s R search tool is a great help so DSN has put together a search widget that only queries R sites Post a Comment Click here to cancel reply Required fields are marked Name Email Website Comment Notify me of new comments via email Notify me of new posts via email Tip Jar The Tip Jar is working again via a temporary location Pages About Blog Rules and Road Map CA Assistant CA blog setup Contact Steve Mc Econometric References FAQ 2005 Gridded Data High Resolution Ocean Sediments Hockey Stick Studies Proxy Data Station Data Statistics and R Subscribe to CA Tip Jar Categories Categories Select Category AIT Archiving Nature Science climategate cg2 Data Disclosure and Diligence Peer Review FOIA General Holocene Optimum Hurricane Inquiries Muir Russell IPCC ar5 MBH98 Replication Source Code Spot the Hockey Stick Modeling Hansen Santer UK Met Office Multiproxy Studies Briffa Crowley D Arrigo 2006 Esper et al 2002 Hansen Hegerl 2006 Jones Mann 2003 Jones et al 1998 Juckes et al 2006 Kaufman 2009 Loehle 2007 Loehle 2008 Mann et al 2007 Mann et al 2008 Mann et al 2009 Marcott 2013 Moberg 2005 pages2k Trouet 2009 Wahl and Ammann News and Commentary MM Proxies Almagre Antarctica bristlecones Divergence Geological Ice core Jacoby Mann PC1 Medieval Noamer Treeline Ocean sediment Post 1980 Proxies Solar Speleothem Thompson Yamal and Urals Reports Barton Committee NAS Panel Satellite and gridcell Scripts Sea Ice Sea Level Rise Statistics Multivariate RegEM Spurious Steig at al 2009 Surface Record CRU GISTEMP GISTEMP Replication Jones et al 1990 SST Steig at al 2009 UHI TGGWS Uncategorized Unthreaded Articles CCSP Workshop Nov05 McIntyre McKitrick 2003 MM05 GRL MM05 EE NAS Panel Reply to Huybers Reply to von Storch Blogroll Accuweather Blogs Andrew Revkin Anthony Watts Bishop Hill Bob Tisdale Dan Hughes David Stockwell Icecap Idsos James Annan Jeff Id Josh Halpern Judith Curry Keith Kloor Klimazweibel Lubos Motl Lucia s Blackboard Matt Briggs NASA GISS Nature Blogs RealClimate Roger Pielke Jr Roger Pielke Sr Roman M Science of Doom Tamino Warwick Hughes Watts Up With That William Connolley WordPress com World Climate Report Favorite posts Bring the Proxies up to date Due Diligence FAQ 2005 McKitrick What is the Hockey Stick debate about Overview Responses to MBH Some thoughts on Disclosure Wegman and North Reports for Newbies Links Acronyms Latex Symbols MBH 98 Steve s Public Data Archive WDCP Wegman Reply to Stupak Wegman Report Weblogs and resources Ross McKitrick Surface Stations Archives Archives Select Month February 2016 January 2016 December 2015 September 2015 August 2015 July 2015 June 2015 April 2015 March 2015 February 2015 January 2015 December 2014 November 2014 October 2014 September 2014 August 2014 July 2014 June 2014 May 2014 April 2014 March 2014 February 2014 January 2014 December 2013 November 2013 October 2013 September 2013 August 2013 July 2013 June 2013 May 2013 April 2013 March 2013 January 2013 December 2012 November 2012 October 2012 September 2012 August 2012 July 2012 June

    Original URL path: http://climateaudit.org/statistics-and-r/?replytocom=37476 (2016-02-08)
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  • Proxy Data « Climate Audit
    at 12 52 PM Permalink Hi unless I missed something I believe that the two proxy data links are broken even after replacing org by info MBH99 Crowley and Lowery 2000 Does anyone else have any information about them or a copy of those files Many thanks Martin mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 14 PM Permalink Reply Re Tree Ring Proxies Tree growth rates are a compound of temperature and watersupply Any home gardener could figure that out On what possible basis then could people with PhD s and professorships propose tree rings as a temperature proxy without at the very least a concurrent record of water supply at the same location No wonder the Saudi s think this is all so much doo doo its not their vested interest in selling oil its their long experience in lots of temperature with no water no trees To them it is a no brainer Adam Collyer Posted Jul 7 2010 at 4 42 PM Permalink Reply Even more interestingly wouldn t tree rings depend on CO2 concentration over long timescales Plants grow faster as CO2 concentrations rise So couldn t tree rings be a proxy for CO2 rather than temperature In which case it wouldn t really be surprising if the tree ring temperature record correlated with CO2 because it would really be a CO2 record Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 58 PM Permalink Reply The leaves of trees are used as a CO2 proxy There are also more than half a dozen other proxies for CO2 Which variable correlates most strongly with growth rates depends on which species of tree you are looking at Theoretically if you had a species for each variable you would be able to get really good ideas of past atmospheres In general how fast a plant grows depends of what variable is limiting like a scarce nutrient Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 59 PM Permalink do not understand what reasoning your over long timescales comment was based on Adam Collyer Posted Nov 24 2010 at 1 20 PM Permalink Over long timescales I meant more than yearly In other words obviously the CO2 concentration varies across the year but the tree ring thickness presumably would depend on average CO2 concentrations over periods of more than one year But the fact remains if more CO2 means that tree rings get wider then thicker tree rings could be the result of higher CO2 as well as higher temperature mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 27 PM Permalink Reply the thing that always got be about the hockey stick analysis was that planetary albedo was not modelled as a variable yet consideration of greenhouse effect first principles says it is and a significant one Even if Stephen McIntyre Ross McKindrick and others had not analysised the mathematical modelling Mann et al s work would remain fundamentally and fatally flawed The only decent analysis I have come across which models albedo is by Ermakov Okhlopkov and Stozhkov and which uses a fourier transform to model the constituent contributions to temperature variation over time mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 34 PM Permalink Reply and another thing Ifyou compare the temperature record since about 1850 of the globe the two hemishperes and the difference between the two an interesting pattern emerges The SH where I live is on avereage about 0 1C cooler than the NH but over the past decade that has opened up to about 0 3 degrees This suggests to me that the two hemispheres act quite differently in their contribution to the global average That the two are geographical opposites that is NH is largely land with a polar sea surrounded by land mass and the SH the opposite seems to me that their albedo behaviour is likely quite different and that perhaps the NH tends to drive a warming and the SH a cooling phase This is also consistent with the various dynamic interactions of the seas and atmoshere from N to S John Murphy Posted Feb 18 2010 at 2 13 AM Permalink Reply Steve Have you seen the new paper by Keith Briffa at http www cru uea ac uk cru people briffa yamal2009 Regards Steve that was out in late October See contemporary posts for much discussion wooden spoon Posted Feb 26 2010 at 5 41 PM Permalink Reply A new paper that casts doubt on the findings of Berkelhammer Stott s oxygen isotope bristlecone departure Abstract is here http hol sagepub com cgi content abstract 20 1 3 ButchKelly Posted May 10 2010 at 4 55 PM Permalink Reply Of course CO2 has been increasing also any gardener will tell you that an increase in fertilizer will increase the rate of growth Lars Jonsson Posted Jan 18 2011 at 12 21 PM Permalink Reply Has the following e mail from the CRU climategate regarding Yamal treerings been commented on CA It clearly shows that Briffa have tried to alter the conclusion delt with in Hentemirov 2002 in accordance with the teams effort to show the last centuries unprecedented warmth From Rashit Hantemirov To Keith Briffa Subject Re Yamal paper for The Holocene special issue Date Wed 21 Aug 2002 17 56 18 0500 Reply to Rashit Hantemirov Dear Keith thank you very much for editing our paper It s a pity you strike your name off the list of authors you make an important contribution to writing paper Your corrections and additions surely improve paper I would only notice the next sentence page 8 The low interannual variability and the minimum occurrence of cold extremes during the 20th century argue that the most recent decades of this long summer record represent the most favourable climate conditions for tree growth within the last four millennia I m not sure that this statement follows unambiguous from results presented in this paper Because mean temperatures during last decades according presented reconstruction are not

    Original URL path: http://climateaudit.org/proxy-data/?replytocom=209103 (2016-02-08)
    Open archived version from archive

  • Proxy Data « Climate Audit
    9 2010 at 12 52 PM Permalink Hi unless I missed something I believe that the two proxy data links are broken even after replacing org by info MBH99 Crowley and Lowery 2000 Does anyone else have any information about them or a copy of those files Many thanks Martin mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 14 PM Permalink Reply Re Tree Ring Proxies Tree growth rates are a compound of temperature and watersupply Any home gardener could figure that out On what possible basis then could people with PhD s and professorships propose tree rings as a temperature proxy without at the very least a concurrent record of water supply at the same location No wonder the Saudi s think this is all so much doo doo its not their vested interest in selling oil its their long experience in lots of temperature with no water no trees To them it is a no brainer Adam Collyer Posted Jul 7 2010 at 4 42 PM Permalink Reply Even more interestingly wouldn t tree rings depend on CO2 concentration over long timescales Plants grow faster as CO2 concentrations rise So couldn t tree rings be a proxy for CO2 rather than temperature In which case it wouldn t really be surprising if the tree ring temperature record correlated with CO2 because it would really be a CO2 record Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 58 PM Permalink Reply The leaves of trees are used as a CO2 proxy There are also more than half a dozen other proxies for CO2 Which variable correlates most strongly with growth rates depends on which species of tree you are looking at Theoretically if you had a species for each variable you would be able to get really good ideas of past atmospheres In general how fast a plant grows depends of what variable is limiting like a scarce nutrient Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 59 PM Permalink do not understand what reasoning your over long timescales comment was based on Adam Collyer Posted Nov 24 2010 at 1 20 PM Permalink Over long timescales I meant more than yearly In other words obviously the CO2 concentration varies across the year but the tree ring thickness presumably would depend on average CO2 concentrations over periods of more than one year But the fact remains if more CO2 means that tree rings get wider then thicker tree rings could be the result of higher CO2 as well as higher temperature mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 27 PM Permalink Reply the thing that always got be about the hockey stick analysis was that planetary albedo was not modelled as a variable yet consideration of greenhouse effect first principles says it is and a significant one Even if Stephen McIntyre Ross McKindrick and others had not analysised the mathematical modelling Mann et al s work would remain fundamentally and fatally flawed The only decent analysis I have come across which models albedo is by Ermakov Okhlopkov and Stozhkov and which uses a fourier transform to model the constituent contributions to temperature variation over time mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 34 PM Permalink Reply and another thing Ifyou compare the temperature record since about 1850 of the globe the two hemishperes and the difference between the two an interesting pattern emerges The SH where I live is on avereage about 0 1C cooler than the NH but over the past decade that has opened up to about 0 3 degrees This suggests to me that the two hemispheres act quite differently in their contribution to the global average That the two are geographical opposites that is NH is largely land with a polar sea surrounded by land mass and the SH the opposite seems to me that their albedo behaviour is likely quite different and that perhaps the NH tends to drive a warming and the SH a cooling phase This is also consistent with the various dynamic interactions of the seas and atmoshere from N to S John Murphy Posted Feb 18 2010 at 2 13 AM Permalink Reply Steve Have you seen the new paper by Keith Briffa at http www cru uea ac uk cru people briffa yamal2009 Regards Steve that was out in late October See contemporary posts for much discussion wooden spoon Posted Feb 26 2010 at 5 41 PM Permalink Reply A new paper that casts doubt on the findings of Berkelhammer Stott s oxygen isotope bristlecone departure Abstract is here http hol sagepub com cgi content abstract 20 1 3 ButchKelly Posted May 10 2010 at 4 55 PM Permalink Reply Of course CO2 has been increasing also any gardener will tell you that an increase in fertilizer will increase the rate of growth Lars Jonsson Posted Jan 18 2011 at 12 21 PM Permalink Reply Has the following e mail from the CRU climategate regarding Yamal treerings been commented on CA It clearly shows that Briffa have tried to alter the conclusion delt with in Hentemirov 2002 in accordance with the teams effort to show the last centuries unprecedented warmth From Rashit Hantemirov To Keith Briffa Subject Re Yamal paper for The Holocene special issue Date Wed 21 Aug 2002 17 56 18 0500 Reply to Rashit Hantemirov Dear Keith thank you very much for editing our paper It s a pity you strike your name off the list of authors you make an important contribution to writing paper Your corrections and additions surely improve paper I would only notice the next sentence page 8 The low interannual variability and the minimum occurrence of cold extremes during the 20th century argue that the most recent decades of this long summer record represent the most favourable climate conditions for tree growth within the last four millennia I m not sure that this statement follows unambiguous from results presented in this paper Because mean temperatures during last decades according presented reconstruction

    Original URL path: http://climateaudit.org/proxy-data/?replytocom=245812 (2016-02-08)
    Open archived version from archive

  • Proxy Data « Climate Audit
    at 12 52 PM Permalink Hi unless I missed something I believe that the two proxy data links are broken even after replacing org by info MBH99 Crowley and Lowery 2000 Does anyone else have any information about them or a copy of those files Many thanks Martin mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 14 PM Permalink Reply Re Tree Ring Proxies Tree growth rates are a compound of temperature and watersupply Any home gardener could figure that out On what possible basis then could people with PhD s and professorships propose tree rings as a temperature proxy without at the very least a concurrent record of water supply at the same location No wonder the Saudi s think this is all so much doo doo its not their vested interest in selling oil its their long experience in lots of temperature with no water no trees To them it is a no brainer Adam Collyer Posted Jul 7 2010 at 4 42 PM Permalink Reply Even more interestingly wouldn t tree rings depend on CO2 concentration over long timescales Plants grow faster as CO2 concentrations rise So couldn t tree rings be a proxy for CO2 rather than temperature In which case it wouldn t really be surprising if the tree ring temperature record correlated with CO2 because it would really be a CO2 record Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 58 PM Permalink Reply The leaves of trees are used as a CO2 proxy There are also more than half a dozen other proxies for CO2 Which variable correlates most strongly with growth rates depends on which species of tree you are looking at Theoretically if you had a species for each variable you would be able to get really good ideas of past atmospheres In general how fast a plant grows depends of what variable is limiting like a scarce nutrient Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 59 PM Permalink do not understand what reasoning your over long timescales comment was based on Adam Collyer Posted Nov 24 2010 at 1 20 PM Permalink Over long timescales I meant more than yearly In other words obviously the CO2 concentration varies across the year but the tree ring thickness presumably would depend on average CO2 concentrations over periods of more than one year But the fact remains if more CO2 means that tree rings get wider then thicker tree rings could be the result of higher CO2 as well as higher temperature mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 27 PM Permalink Reply the thing that always got be about the hockey stick analysis was that planetary albedo was not modelled as a variable yet consideration of greenhouse effect first principles says it is and a significant one Even if Stephen McIntyre Ross McKindrick and others had not analysised the mathematical modelling Mann et al s work would remain fundamentally and fatally flawed The only decent analysis I have come across which models albedo is by Ermakov Okhlopkov and Stozhkov and which uses a fourier transform to model the constituent contributions to temperature variation over time mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 34 PM Permalink Reply and another thing Ifyou compare the temperature record since about 1850 of the globe the two hemishperes and the difference between the two an interesting pattern emerges The SH where I live is on avereage about 0 1C cooler than the NH but over the past decade that has opened up to about 0 3 degrees This suggests to me that the two hemispheres act quite differently in their contribution to the global average That the two are geographical opposites that is NH is largely land with a polar sea surrounded by land mass and the SH the opposite seems to me that their albedo behaviour is likely quite different and that perhaps the NH tends to drive a warming and the SH a cooling phase This is also consistent with the various dynamic interactions of the seas and atmoshere from N to S John Murphy Posted Feb 18 2010 at 2 13 AM Permalink Reply Steve Have you seen the new paper by Keith Briffa at http www cru uea ac uk cru people briffa yamal2009 Regards Steve that was out in late October See contemporary posts for much discussion wooden spoon Posted Feb 26 2010 at 5 41 PM Permalink Reply A new paper that casts doubt on the findings of Berkelhammer Stott s oxygen isotope bristlecone departure Abstract is here http hol sagepub com cgi content abstract 20 1 3 ButchKelly Posted May 10 2010 at 4 55 PM Permalink Reply Of course CO2 has been increasing also any gardener will tell you that an increase in fertilizer will increase the rate of growth Lars Jonsson Posted Jan 18 2011 at 12 21 PM Permalink Reply Has the following e mail from the CRU climategate regarding Yamal treerings been commented on CA It clearly shows that Briffa have tried to alter the conclusion delt with in Hentemirov 2002 in accordance with the teams effort to show the last centuries unprecedented warmth From Rashit Hantemirov To Keith Briffa Subject Re Yamal paper for The Holocene special issue Date Wed 21 Aug 2002 17 56 18 0500 Reply to Rashit Hantemirov Dear Keith thank you very much for editing our paper It s a pity you strike your name off the list of authors you make an important contribution to writing paper Your corrections and additions surely improve paper I would only notice the next sentence page 8 The low interannual variability and the minimum occurrence of cold extremes during the 20th century argue that the most recent decades of this long summer record represent the most favourable climate conditions for tree growth within the last four millennia I m not sure that this statement follows unambiguous from results presented in this paper Because mean temperatures during last decades according presented reconstruction are not

    Original URL path: http://climateaudit.org/proxy-data/?replytocom=210318 (2016-02-08)
    Open archived version from archive

  • Proxy Data « Climate Audit
    at 12 52 PM Permalink Hi unless I missed something I believe that the two proxy data links are broken even after replacing org by info MBH99 Crowley and Lowery 2000 Does anyone else have any information about them or a copy of those files Many thanks Martin mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 14 PM Permalink Reply Re Tree Ring Proxies Tree growth rates are a compound of temperature and watersupply Any home gardener could figure that out On what possible basis then could people with PhD s and professorships propose tree rings as a temperature proxy without at the very least a concurrent record of water supply at the same location No wonder the Saudi s think this is all so much doo doo its not their vested interest in selling oil its their long experience in lots of temperature with no water no trees To them it is a no brainer Adam Collyer Posted Jul 7 2010 at 4 42 PM Permalink Reply Even more interestingly wouldn t tree rings depend on CO2 concentration over long timescales Plants grow faster as CO2 concentrations rise So couldn t tree rings be a proxy for CO2 rather than temperature In which case it wouldn t really be surprising if the tree ring temperature record correlated with CO2 because it would really be a CO2 record Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 58 PM Permalink Reply The leaves of trees are used as a CO2 proxy There are also more than half a dozen other proxies for CO2 Which variable correlates most strongly with growth rates depends on which species of tree you are looking at Theoretically if you had a species for each variable you would be able to get really good ideas of past atmospheres In general how fast a plant grows depends of what variable is limiting like a scarce nutrient Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 59 PM Permalink do not understand what reasoning your over long timescales comment was based on Adam Collyer Posted Nov 24 2010 at 1 20 PM Permalink Over long timescales I meant more than yearly In other words obviously the CO2 concentration varies across the year but the tree ring thickness presumably would depend on average CO2 concentrations over periods of more than one year But the fact remains if more CO2 means that tree rings get wider then thicker tree rings could be the result of higher CO2 as well as higher temperature mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 27 PM Permalink Reply the thing that always got be about the hockey stick analysis was that planetary albedo was not modelled as a variable yet consideration of greenhouse effect first principles says it is and a significant one Even if Stephen McIntyre Ross McKindrick and others had not analysised the mathematical modelling Mann et al s work would remain fundamentally and fatally flawed The only decent analysis I have come across which models albedo is by Ermakov Okhlopkov and Stozhkov and which uses a fourier transform to model the constituent contributions to temperature variation over time mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 34 PM Permalink Reply and another thing Ifyou compare the temperature record since about 1850 of the globe the two hemishperes and the difference between the two an interesting pattern emerges The SH where I live is on avereage about 0 1C cooler than the NH but over the past decade that has opened up to about 0 3 degrees This suggests to me that the two hemispheres act quite differently in their contribution to the global average That the two are geographical opposites that is NH is largely land with a polar sea surrounded by land mass and the SH the opposite seems to me that their albedo behaviour is likely quite different and that perhaps the NH tends to drive a warming and the SH a cooling phase This is also consistent with the various dynamic interactions of the seas and atmoshere from N to S John Murphy Posted Feb 18 2010 at 2 13 AM Permalink Reply Steve Have you seen the new paper by Keith Briffa at http www cru uea ac uk cru people briffa yamal2009 Regards Steve that was out in late October See contemporary posts for much discussion wooden spoon Posted Feb 26 2010 at 5 41 PM Permalink Reply A new paper that casts doubt on the findings of Berkelhammer Stott s oxygen isotope bristlecone departure Abstract is here http hol sagepub com cgi content abstract 20 1 3 ButchKelly Posted May 10 2010 at 4 55 PM Permalink Reply Of course CO2 has been increasing also any gardener will tell you that an increase in fertilizer will increase the rate of growth Lars Jonsson Posted Jan 18 2011 at 12 21 PM Permalink Reply Has the following e mail from the CRU climategate regarding Yamal treerings been commented on CA It clearly shows that Briffa have tried to alter the conclusion delt with in Hentemirov 2002 in accordance with the teams effort to show the last centuries unprecedented warmth From Rashit Hantemirov To Keith Briffa Subject Re Yamal paper for The Holocene special issue Date Wed 21 Aug 2002 17 56 18 0500 Reply to Rashit Hantemirov Dear Keith thank you very much for editing our paper It s a pity you strike your name off the list of authors you make an important contribution to writing paper Your corrections and additions surely improve paper I would only notice the next sentence page 8 The low interannual variability and the minimum occurrence of cold extremes during the 20th century argue that the most recent decades of this long summer record represent the most favourable climate conditions for tree growth within the last four millennia I m not sure that this statement follows unambiguous from results presented in this paper Because mean temperatures during last decades according presented reconstruction are not

    Original URL path: http://climateaudit.org/proxy-data/?replytocom=210614 (2016-02-08)
    Open archived version from archive

  • Proxy Data « Climate Audit
    9 2010 at 12 52 PM Permalink Hi unless I missed something I believe that the two proxy data links are broken even after replacing org by info MBH99 Crowley and Lowery 2000 Does anyone else have any information about them or a copy of those files Many thanks Martin mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 14 PM Permalink Reply Re Tree Ring Proxies Tree growth rates are a compound of temperature and watersupply Any home gardener could figure that out On what possible basis then could people with PhD s and professorships propose tree rings as a temperature proxy without at the very least a concurrent record of water supply at the same location No wonder the Saudi s think this is all so much doo doo its not their vested interest in selling oil its their long experience in lots of temperature with no water no trees To them it is a no brainer Adam Collyer Posted Jul 7 2010 at 4 42 PM Permalink Reply Even more interestingly wouldn t tree rings depend on CO2 concentration over long timescales Plants grow faster as CO2 concentrations rise So couldn t tree rings be a proxy for CO2 rather than temperature In which case it wouldn t really be surprising if the tree ring temperature record correlated with CO2 because it would really be a CO2 record Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 58 PM Permalink Reply The leaves of trees are used as a CO2 proxy There are also more than half a dozen other proxies for CO2 Which variable correlates most strongly with growth rates depends on which species of tree you are looking at Theoretically if you had a species for each variable you would be able to get really good ideas of past atmospheres In general how fast a plant grows depends of what variable is limiting like a scarce nutrient Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 59 PM Permalink do not understand what reasoning your over long timescales comment was based on Adam Collyer Posted Nov 24 2010 at 1 20 PM Permalink Over long timescales I meant more than yearly In other words obviously the CO2 concentration varies across the year but the tree ring thickness presumably would depend on average CO2 concentrations over periods of more than one year But the fact remains if more CO2 means that tree rings get wider then thicker tree rings could be the result of higher CO2 as well as higher temperature mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 27 PM Permalink Reply the thing that always got be about the hockey stick analysis was that planetary albedo was not modelled as a variable yet consideration of greenhouse effect first principles says it is and a significant one Even if Stephen McIntyre Ross McKindrick and others had not analysised the mathematical modelling Mann et al s work would remain fundamentally and fatally flawed The only decent analysis I have come across which models albedo is by Ermakov Okhlopkov and Stozhkov and which uses a fourier transform to model the constituent contributions to temperature variation over time mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 34 PM Permalink Reply and another thing Ifyou compare the temperature record since about 1850 of the globe the two hemishperes and the difference between the two an interesting pattern emerges The SH where I live is on avereage about 0 1C cooler than the NH but over the past decade that has opened up to about 0 3 degrees This suggests to me that the two hemispheres act quite differently in their contribution to the global average That the two are geographical opposites that is NH is largely land with a polar sea surrounded by land mass and the SH the opposite seems to me that their albedo behaviour is likely quite different and that perhaps the NH tends to drive a warming and the SH a cooling phase This is also consistent with the various dynamic interactions of the seas and atmoshere from N to S John Murphy Posted Feb 18 2010 at 2 13 AM Permalink Reply Steve Have you seen the new paper by Keith Briffa at http www cru uea ac uk cru people briffa yamal2009 Regards Steve that was out in late October See contemporary posts for much discussion wooden spoon Posted Feb 26 2010 at 5 41 PM Permalink Reply A new paper that casts doubt on the findings of Berkelhammer Stott s oxygen isotope bristlecone departure Abstract is here http hol sagepub com cgi content abstract 20 1 3 ButchKelly Posted May 10 2010 at 4 55 PM Permalink Reply Of course CO2 has been increasing also any gardener will tell you that an increase in fertilizer will increase the rate of growth Lars Jonsson Posted Jan 18 2011 at 12 21 PM Permalink Reply Has the following e mail from the CRU climategate regarding Yamal treerings been commented on CA It clearly shows that Briffa have tried to alter the conclusion delt with in Hentemirov 2002 in accordance with the teams effort to show the last centuries unprecedented warmth From Rashit Hantemirov To Keith Briffa Subject Re Yamal paper for The Holocene special issue Date Wed 21 Aug 2002 17 56 18 0500 Reply to Rashit Hantemirov Dear Keith thank you very much for editing our paper It s a pity you strike your name off the list of authors you make an important contribution to writing paper Your corrections and additions surely improve paper I would only notice the next sentence page 8 The low interannual variability and the minimum occurrence of cold extremes during the 20th century argue that the most recent decades of this long summer record represent the most favourable climate conditions for tree growth within the last four millennia I m not sure that this statement follows unambiguous from results presented in this paper Because mean temperatures during last decades according presented reconstruction

    Original URL path: http://climateaudit.org/proxy-data/?replytocom=214878 (2016-02-08)
    Open archived version from archive

  • Proxy Data « Climate Audit
    9 2010 at 12 52 PM Permalink Hi unless I missed something I believe that the two proxy data links are broken even after replacing org by info MBH99 Crowley and Lowery 2000 Does anyone else have any information about them or a copy of those files Many thanks Martin mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 14 PM Permalink Reply Re Tree Ring Proxies Tree growth rates are a compound of temperature and watersupply Any home gardener could figure that out On what possible basis then could people with PhD s and professorships propose tree rings as a temperature proxy without at the very least a concurrent record of water supply at the same location No wonder the Saudi s think this is all so much doo doo its not their vested interest in selling oil its their long experience in lots of temperature with no water no trees To them it is a no brainer Adam Collyer Posted Jul 7 2010 at 4 42 PM Permalink Reply Even more interestingly wouldn t tree rings depend on CO2 concentration over long timescales Plants grow faster as CO2 concentrations rise So couldn t tree rings be a proxy for CO2 rather than temperature In which case it wouldn t really be surprising if the tree ring temperature record correlated with CO2 because it would really be a CO2 record Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 58 PM Permalink Reply The leaves of trees are used as a CO2 proxy There are also more than half a dozen other proxies for CO2 Which variable correlates most strongly with growth rates depends on which species of tree you are looking at Theoretically if you had a species for each variable you would be able to get really good ideas of past atmospheres In general how fast a plant grows depends of what variable is limiting like a scarce nutrient Gogo Posted Nov 23 2010 at 3 59 PM Permalink do not understand what reasoning your over long timescales comment was based on Adam Collyer Posted Nov 24 2010 at 1 20 PM Permalink Over long timescales I meant more than yearly In other words obviously the CO2 concentration varies across the year but the tree ring thickness presumably would depend on average CO2 concentrations over periods of more than one year But the fact remains if more CO2 means that tree rings get wider then thicker tree rings could be the result of higher CO2 as well as higher temperature mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 27 PM Permalink Reply the thing that always got be about the hockey stick analysis was that planetary albedo was not modelled as a variable yet consideration of greenhouse effect first principles says it is and a significant one Even if Stephen McIntyre Ross McKindrick and others had not analysised the mathematical modelling Mann et al s work would remain fundamentally and fatally flawed The only decent analysis I have come across which models albedo is by Ermakov Okhlopkov and Stozhkov and which uses a fourier transform to model the constituent contributions to temperature variation over time mike seward Posted Feb 7 2010 at 11 34 PM Permalink Reply and another thing Ifyou compare the temperature record since about 1850 of the globe the two hemishperes and the difference between the two an interesting pattern emerges The SH where I live is on avereage about 0 1C cooler than the NH but over the past decade that has opened up to about 0 3 degrees This suggests to me that the two hemispheres act quite differently in their contribution to the global average That the two are geographical opposites that is NH is largely land with a polar sea surrounded by land mass and the SH the opposite seems to me that their albedo behaviour is likely quite different and that perhaps the NH tends to drive a warming and the SH a cooling phase This is also consistent with the various dynamic interactions of the seas and atmoshere from N to S John Murphy Posted Feb 18 2010 at 2 13 AM Permalink Reply Steve Have you seen the new paper by Keith Briffa at http www cru uea ac uk cru people briffa yamal2009 Regards Steve that was out in late October See contemporary posts for much discussion wooden spoon Posted Feb 26 2010 at 5 41 PM Permalink Reply A new paper that casts doubt on the findings of Berkelhammer Stott s oxygen isotope bristlecone departure Abstract is here http hol sagepub com cgi content abstract 20 1 3 ButchKelly Posted May 10 2010 at 4 55 PM Permalink Reply Of course CO2 has been increasing also any gardener will tell you that an increase in fertilizer will increase the rate of growth Lars Jonsson Posted Jan 18 2011 at 12 21 PM Permalink Reply Has the following e mail from the CRU climategate regarding Yamal treerings been commented on CA It clearly shows that Briffa have tried to alter the conclusion delt with in Hentemirov 2002 in accordance with the teams effort to show the last centuries unprecedented warmth From Rashit Hantemirov To Keith Briffa Subject Re Yamal paper for The Holocene special issue Date Wed 21 Aug 2002 17 56 18 0500 Reply to Rashit Hantemirov Dear Keith thank you very much for editing our paper It s a pity you strike your name off the list of authors you make an important contribution to writing paper Your corrections and additions surely improve paper I would only notice the next sentence page 8 The low interannual variability and the minimum occurrence of cold extremes during the 20th century argue that the most recent decades of this long summer record represent the most favourable climate conditions for tree growth within the last four millennia I m not sure that this statement follows unambiguous from results presented in this paper Because mean temperatures during last decades according presented reconstruction

    Original URL path: http://climateaudit.org/proxy-data/?replytocom=214906 (2016-02-08)
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